You’ll learn in this podcast from Walter how he experienced:
– Severe RA that had him bedridden
– Methotrexate fatigue
– Enbrel “hang over” side effects
– Humira caused all of his RA to return again
– Xeljanz caused massive nausea and constipation
– The dangers of antibiotic overuse which may lead to RA onset
– How the nasal passage is a great indicator of food sensitivities
– And how Walter is doing great on the Paddison Program for RA which has no side effects
Disclaimer -the information on this site is not medical advice. Before making any changes to your lifestyle, diet, exercise, drug or supplement routines you must first discuss the changes with a licensed professional. [spp-player URL=https://paddisonprogram.podbean.com/mf/play/v48mya/Paddison_Podcast_Episode_43_Walter_Atkins.mp3″]
Clint: Good day Walter, thanks for coming on the episode, mate.
Walter: Sure, man. I’m glad to be here.
Clint: So, this is all about me putting myself in your shoes and me making some commentary about what I would do if I was in your situation. So, why don’t we hear a little bit about your journey up until now? And then once we cover that, then it’ll become clear as to how I might be able to make some suggestions.
Walter: Sure. Yeah. I was clinically diagnosed in, I guess it was January of 2014, just a big flaring episode and then this…then it started to fall like dominos, you know, different…CRP, sed rates went up into mid-150. It was… Yeah, yeah, I was really sick. It got to a point where I couldn’t even roll over in bed, couldn’t even move myself. My wife had to roll me over in bed. That was the first year. First year, I didn’t take any medication. I tried to go holistically. Then my anemia got so bad, started losing mass amounts of weight. And then finally…so then I had to go on a biologic and then started…well, I guess, I took Methotrexate first. We tried that. It was very unsuccessful. And I had…I’m horrible with drugs, like most people, but I’m so unsuccessful. I had to take a baby dose of everything. And then started down the path, man. The side effects…
Clint: What were your side effects of Methotrexate, all the common stuff like fatigue and the feeling of toxicity and liver problems?
Walter: Yeah, for sure. Fatigue was the main one. I mean, I was…in order to take this drug, they gave me Clonazepam and I would take a Clonazepam pill and I would shove the pill in my mouth right before I literally pass out from Clonazepam in order to take my medication. That’s how terrified I was of taking my medication. So I would literally induce myself with Clonazepam then take my medication. And then for a week later, it was just misery. Yeah, I think just fatigue, I’d be in public and had to sit down and fall asleep in public, just lots of fatigue. Yeah, so that means the same story.
Then came the Enbrel, the biologic…I didn’t have a choice. My blood anemia was really getting so bad that we had to pull the trigger on something. Now, that was one of the worst days of my life, having to decide to put that…inject that stuff into my, you know, in my body. That horrible reaction the first time, vertigo, dizzy, it took me weeks to finally get to where I could take a shot, and I was taking the 25 milligram just once a week. I was taking half a dose and still just laboring to get through it.
Clint: And what was the side effects of that one, of Enbrel?
Walter: Enbrel, boy, like massive hangover. I take it and then for 48 hours, I mean, it was hard to get out of bed, just nausea, dizziness, ears ringing. And just…I caught the wet blanket. It was like just a wet blanket would come over me and I would just morose down the dumps for three or four days and finally as I peel out of it, it was time for the next shot, just like, “Oh, no, not again”. And, you know, you’re like it’s the same thing, you know, like, “Whoa, okay.” But you know what the doctors have told you that your fingers are gonna curl up, all these things are gonna happen so you’re terrified not to take it.
I mean, it shows what…for me, these drugs show what level of pain people have to be in, to read the side effects and still willingly inject it into your body. I mean, most people would look at that and go, “Not a chance in hell would I possibly put that in my body.” So I think it proves…should prove to people just how desperate you get to be willing to inject this stuff into your body.
Clint: Yeah, well said.
Walter: Yeah, you know. And it did have some effect. It got me out of a dark place. It did, as far as arthritis. Not emotionally wise, no. Emotionally, I was a wreck from the drugs. But then my body eventually built up an immunity to it. And then actually the injection started causing more arthritis pain than it was taking away, like pain to my chest everywhere. So we went off it. Then my doctor recommended one of the worst decisions I’ve ever made, he said, “Let’s try Humira”. And Humira came on really close to killing me almost. It was insane.
I injected the Humira. Within three hours, it was…all the progress I had made…because I have been from the Paddison Program since December of last year so I’ve made a lot of progress. And then within three hours, I took the shot, it began shaking, fever, hives, all came from one shot of Humira. And then within five days, every bit of arthritis I had gained reset to the very level I had at the very beginning. And that was a setback that was really tough to take because I’d made all this progress, worked so hard and then in one fell swoop, in one shot, I went back seven months and had to start all over again.
So I really had to regroup and my wife had to help regroup and get the courage to just start over again. And so now I have and now…and so that…so basically that’s where we stand now. And then, I’m sorry, I took that so then, they tried to put me back and they…I tried…oh god, it was…what was the pill? And then they put me on Xeljanz, so I tried that. Xeljanz came, yeah, that came with massive nausea, constipation. And I didn’t wanna take that because I didn’t wanna put anything else to harm my intestinal lining. So I’m like, I tell the doctor, “I don’t wanna take any…” because one of the side effects is tears in your intestinal lining, like that’s what I’m trying to heal myself from, you know, so.
Anyway, long story short, just trying to talk a little bit, sorry. So I couldn’t take that so they tried Enbrel one more time, so three more shots.
Clint: Oh, yeah?
Walter: Yeah, because the doctor’s like…because he couldn’t give me Remicade because that stuff’s terrifying and I was such a poor drug taker anyway. So I eventually…then they put me on Plaquenil which is that anti…
Clint: Plaquenil? Yeah.
Walter: Yeah, that anti…yeah. The fatigue with that was just as equal to…
Walter: …Methotrexate. But finally I just said, “Okay, this is it. It’s time to take my leap of faith.” Went off all my drugs and my CRP and sed rate dropped 20 points, just like when I cut the drugs. It was amazing, there it was. And so now, I take Ibuprofen as needed. Most recently, I went five weeks without any Ibuprofen, no medication at all. But…
Walter: Yeah, there are times when I still get…I mean, if I get a really bad flare, which is not often because it’s all food related, I’ll have to take it for a day or two. I take two Advil in the morning and that’s all I take all day when I have to take it, so.
Clint: Right, right. Mate, well, you’ve…
Walter: So that’s where I’m at.
Clint: That’s quite a summary right there. You pretty much went through the entire medical cabinet right there.
Walter: I took everything that they had to give me. I mean, because like I failed everything. I kept failing every medications. They just kept here’s another one, here’s another one. I kept failing. I mean, dramatically failing them, so. But the whole time, I was eating correctly, the whole time. I mean, I took tons of pictures of food I was gonna send to you one day and say, “Look, here’s my…all my bok choys. I have tons of photos of my food. So the whole time I’m doing this, I’m actually healing my intestine, slowly during the time. I’m going through all this madness and underneath it all, it’s working, you know, because I mean ferment my own cabbage, I make my own probiotics. And so underlying… and so then I went off all the medication, I found myself in a much better place than I thought because it’s actually been working behind the scenes and, you know, so.
Clint: Yeah, that is fantastic. That’s fantastic. So when was the last time then you were on one of the heavy drugs? Not the ibuprofen but when was the last time you were on the prescription stuff, seven months?
Walter: The last time I…no. Enbrel was probably four months ago.
Clint: Okay, four months ago. All right.
Walter: The last time…
Clint: So does your C-reactive protein and sed rate nicely track and correspond with your inflammation or do you find that it’s a useless measure?
Walter: No, no, no. I think it’s a good way to measure. And it’s pretty accurate with how I’m feeling. There had been times I’ve gone to get my labs done and I’ve been able to guess within 10 points of what they’re gonna be. I’m like, “Oh, I guarantee I’m this, this.” and right there it was, you know.
Clint: Okay. Well, that is exactly how I was, exactly. Like I used to be…
Walter: Oh, really? Yeah, right.
Clint: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, once I was getting sort of between the ones and two milligram per liter you know, I would say to my wife…you know, and I would always try and predict it. I would say, “I think I’m a 1.7.” you know what I mean?
Walter: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, for sure. It was a game I play and I was usually right.
Clint: Yeah, exactly. And so that is highly useful because a lot of people who go through this process…not a…you know, it’s a smaller percentage but it’s still significant. People see C-reactive proteins just aren’t very useful for their disease measure. So some people, for instance, can be really highly inflamed and have very low C-reactive protein and very low sed rate, in fact totally normal even when they’re highly inflamed. And so, that’s even worse situation because it makes it hard to get that quantitative monthly measurement of how you’re doing. But it’s still possible but you have to use other measures. And so, it’s not as good as having the perfect number every month to look at.
Walter: Yeah, for sure. I mean…
Clint: Yeah, man. So how…what’s…how’s the best way then for us to spend the next little while? How can I get you to the next level?
Walter: Well, I tell you what, you caught me on a really amazing day as I just made a pretty phenomenal…I guess when you’re doing this program, your program…and I draw from McDougall, I draw from you, I draw from Forks Over Knives, everything you can. I think you really have to collectively pull together, is I finally figured out that white rice…because that became a staple of my diet. And the starch in the rice, so I switched over to brown rice and I’ve had a really big…it was crazy. What was happening is I was eating the rice and I was getting like the sugar crush because it was metabolizing really, really fast. Then I would crave sugar at night like, “Oh.”
Anyway, so I [inaudible 00:10:34] and that has been the huge impact the last two days and I’ve noticed a lot less in the morning, a lot less stiffness in the morning. So yeah, so you caught me on a day where I’ve just had a really big discovery, you know. I mean, I’m constantly, always constantly, every day researching. I mean, I think you have to when you do this. I mean, you can get stuck in a pattern of eating the same thing and expecting results but…and if you go a week or a week and a half and nothing’s really changed then it’s time to relook at your diet and what do I switch around and what do I move. And I think you constantly have to be kind of putting your chess pieces together and constantly working at it. I mean, nothing is gonna work all the time perfectly, you know, if that makes sense, what I’m saying?
Walter: Yeah, right. Yeah. So the Paddison Program was the piece of the puzzle that I really was needing, and I think it was the real structure of it for me. Sometimes the juices I can’t handle, sometimes the smoothies I can’t handle, sometimes I can. Sometimes it’s a little too much on my stomach.
Clint: Yeah. Sometimes it just ends up coming out the other end, eh?
Walter: Well, it just…it would kind of nausea. I mean some a little bit.
Walter: I’m highly sensitive.
Clint: It’s so detoxing. I mean it’s just…you know, you got all this…you got all this chlorophyll hitting the bloodstream, you’ve got all of this greens. It’s just so much green goodness hitting. It’s totally detoxing. Yeah, so that’s no surprise.
Before we move on, let me just make a quick comment. So there’s no doubt about it that the brown rice is a healthier version of rice. There’s no doubt about that brown is healthier than white. And it was one of the true counter-intuitive parts of putting my program together, to schedule white rice before brown rice in the hierarchy of introductions, right?
But if we’re talking about…and I even think this applies to you. If we talk about, you know, trying to make a program that can be as close as working for everyone as you can get, I feel that it’s still the right order to go from a white rice before moving on the brown. And I call it graduate, you know, you graduate to get to the brown rice because of it’s…it comes back to an acidity angle, I believe. It’s very tricky to explain but I believe the reason is because the brown rice is far more acidifying for the body than what the white is. And I think that’s part of it. And there are other benefits for having white as well in the early stages, is because you can eat a lot of it and get a lot of calories from it. And one of the biggest challenges that people face is that they feel that they’re underweight or they’re not eating enough food. White’s easy to get in much more bigger quantities because with brown, you always chew, chew, chew, chew, chew.
Walter: Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah.
Clint: And so, I just want, you know, for the benefit of people wondering about…some people will say to me, “Oh, maybe I should switch straight to the brown”. Well, you know, that’s where we all wanna end up but we have to do our time, you know.
Walter: Well, yeah. I mean, I call it like sharpening…I’m sharpening the knife and getting to the end of the spear. And so white rice was right. And now, as I’m getting better and healing more, I’m finding I’m kind of having to rearrange a couple of things and brown rice was a thing. I agree, white rice is perfect. But as I get better, I’m learning I’m having to change things a little bit, to modify a little bit, to kind of move along with where I’m going.
So yeah, I think white rice is [inaudible 00:14:14]. And, you know, here in the states, we’re so protein crazy, it’s so hard. I mean, it’s just insane in this country. I mean, the first thing they ever ask me on Padds Program, where’d you get your protein? How do you get protein? I’m like I get plenty of protein. I don’t eat meat. Oh, how do you get protein? I mean, we’re just so ingrained by the beef industry that, you know, you should have this much protein. So it’s [inaudible 00:14:37] things, you know. And white rice is great. I didn’t mean to, any way.
Clint: No, no. And…
Walter: [inaudible 00:14:43] but it was…it got me to where I’m at. And that was just the next logical step, which was to kind of switch over.
Clint: Beautiful. All right. Well, what…this is all…instead of this sounding like a what I would do situation, it sounds more like a success story situation. I think that, to a large extent, it actually is because you’re on no drugs. It’s been four months since you’ve taken any and you’ve been five weeks without an Ibuprofen. I mean, your situation is extremely rare. If you look at a graph, a distribution graph, of where people are with this disease in terms of like how many are medicated, how many are non-medicated, how many have like, you know, elevated inflammation levels.
The component that would be on zero drugs with an established condition… because you’re January of 2014. So at the time we’re recording this, like you’re…what’s that? Two and a half years or coming towards three years. You know, you’re in a 0.5% percentile bracket. Like you’re not even like one in a hundred, it’s more rare than that, okay? So it’s pretty remarkable. Yeah.
Walter: Well, you know, I remember this in Danny. And one thing that really stuck with me, he’s like, “I take this on like it’s my job. Beating arthritis it’s like it’s my job. I do it every day”. And I went to that immediately. And every day, my goal is in that day, what can I do to beat this RA? And it’s food choices and Paddison program. And so it’s not slipping up. It’s not making…and the reason I’m having a success because you have to be diligent with this. I mean, you really have to be diligent. I mean, RA’s relentless. You have to be more relentless with staying in the course and doing it correctly and like make every bite right.
I mean, I tell my wife today…I’ll eat and I’ll go…I’ll say Clint would be proud of me because I’m literally, every food I’ve got a big bowl of greens. And in every bite, I’m shoving greens in my mouth at the same time. And…but it is collectively each meal at a time. It’s not…and then it ends up being a whole body of work but you have to look at every single one as another chance to heal your body. And that’s how you can have success and that’s how I’ve had success is by not just going, “Oh, you know, maybe this week I won’t do this.” Well, that week…and you’re right. And in the program, you talk about getting a setback and getting in a healing groove and how long it can take once you get knocked out of it. It happened to me once or twice and I was like, “No”. And you were exactly right in talking about that in your program in getting knocked out of a groove, wow, and you desperately try to get back in it. Then when you’re in it, I finally learn just don’t get out of it.
Clint: That’s it.
Walter: Just…yeah, just keep working, you know.
Clint: A hundred percent, man. This is…you know, I can picture you on stage explaining all this stuff because your understanding of it and your, you know, way of explaining it is outstanding. So, you know, this is fabulous stuff. It is. Every day, it’s like what…I used to ask myself the question, what can I do right now to improve my health and lower my pain levels? And then, once I took that action, I then said what else can I do right now? And that was it, all the time. Because no one else is going to offer a solution that is acceptable. And so it’s up to us to deploy the rocket launchers that we can against this problem.
Walter: Right. I mean, I took what they had to give me. I took all the drugs. I said, “Okay, I’ll do it.” And I said, “Okay. Now I’ve seen what you have to offer and I know that there’s no hope in the bottom of that bottle or that injection. I know there’s none.” I mean, you could feel it. So, I mean, you have to take on like the Paddison Program or any program with almost like a religious fervor. You have to truly believe, in my mind, you have to truly when you wake in the morning go, “I can really heal myself from this disease”.
And you have to believe it. Not just a frivolous like, “Well this might work, this might not work.” I mean, you really have to and you believe because that gives you the power to every day…when everyone’s going out to eat and you’re sitting there and you have one strawberry and one blueberry and everyone else is eating and having fun and all different things. So everyone’s having drinks and you’re having a glass of water, it’s all these things that, you know, it’s your life changes and you have to…that belief system that you, that I will be better is what you have to have to get you through those moments, and that’s what I did.
I mean, and that’s why at Paddison Program when I saw that guy, Danny, I saw that. I saw a guy who said, “I’m willing to do anything.” And that’s why I turned on to your program and your program really kind of offers that. And I’ve watched a lot of your videos as well and you kind of portray that same thing. Like you gotta eat it, live it, breath it, sleep it to do it in order to…and I’m not trying to be preachy but that’s how I’ve had success is like, yeah, is accepting it, you know.
And first and foremost, above all this, is people have to accept the fact that they have an exceptional personal responsibility for it. I know that sounds much. I don’t wanna get preachy but that’s when it changed for me, when I said, “Hey, maybe through my diet, maybe through all the antibiotics I was given in my life and all these things that maybe this is happening not…” if you can’t…if you play the [inaudible 00:20:12] and say, “Oh, poor me. Oh, look…you know, bad luck, I got this.” Then you’ll stay on water and you won’t do anything. But if you take some personal responsibility and say, “Hey, maybe I have this…” then it’ll give you the power to fight it.
Clint: Yeah, 100%. One thing that’s of a personal passion of mine at the moment, one of the many projects amongst things that I’m doing, is the sense that antibiotic use, overuse of antibiotics is actually the number one trigger for people with RA. So, can you just tell me how much antibiotics you took prior to diagnosis?
Walter: Yeah. I mean, A, the distribution though of antibiotics in this country is prolific. I had inherited prostatitis from my father. And prostatitis, I wouldn’t get too much into, but it’s a very painful disease. They believe now it’s autoimmune. Anyway, the only thing they had for it was Cipro, big Cipro antibiotics. They start you on a regiment of that. I’d go 10 months, 11 months on Cipro. I did this for four years. I spent probably a totally of three years of my life on an antibiotic, a big scary antibiotic. And no one told me anything about antibiotics.
So I’m in this every day. And look…and then also my indigestion started to get worse. So I’d go to the doctor, “Hey man, I got indigestion”. “Oh, wait, here’s”, what was it, “a protein pump inhibitor”. I’m like, “Okay. Something’s going wrong.” So my body was telling me. So every day, I just keep taking the antibiotics and to no avail. It never helped my condition once. So I had wiped out everything in my body and then I was putting nothing back in and still eating the standard American diet. So I’m eating the same American diet and my gut is just in terrible, terrible shape, dude.
And so, but… not just that, I mean, if you go in with a cold here, they will instantly write you antibiotics. You’re like, “Well, what if it’s viral? I mean, what if [inaudible 00:22:16] they’re like, “Well, it can’t hurt.” I’m like, “Okay”. It’s like…so no matter what you go in for, you’re gonna walk out with antibiotics and the idea of like, “Well, it can’t hurt you”. And that’s what’s happened. So for me, I would guarantee you what started my problem was just those years and years of that Cipro that really just [inaudible 00:22:36]
Clint: A hundred percent. I would, you know, and this is a sort of thing that you can’t really get called out on because no one can really prove it. But I feel absolutely certain that that’s what caused your rheumatoid.
Walter: I agree.
Clint: Yeah. And because I took antibiotics for five years for my acne as a teenager, okay?
Walter: That’s right.
Clint: And then I had indigestion issues just like you. I was seeing naturopaths and homeopaths throughout my late 20s because I thought I don’t digest food very well and I always get like a blocked nose. I can’t breathe through my nose when I eat certain foods, right?
Walter: Are you kidding me? Exactly the same thing. My nose, exactly the same thing. And I eat certain foods on the couch, I’m like, “Can’t breath, honey”.
Clint: Yeah, can’t breathe. And for me, if I ate ice cream, it would happen within minutes, minutes of eating ice cream. Yeah.
Walter: Yes, exactly the same thing.
Clint: And you know what, and I kept doing it. And then I went to Iraq to entertain the troops over there and, of course, the treatment that they give you as an antimalarial is low dose Doxycycline which was the exact drug that I had been taking for my acne as a teenager. And within six months, I had RA. So I believe, you know, that…yeah.
Walter: I failed to mention that I did try…I think it’s called the Road Back which was Doxycycline. I did that for about two months and that was…thank goodness I got away from that. But I mean, that was in my searching for everything for RA and I tried that. And so, I was just hurting myself, you know, didn’t realize it.
Clint: It can be dangerous, yeah. You know, I’ve got my personal views on that. So, you know…
Walter: Yeah, it’s true.
Clint: You and I seem like kindred spirits, it seems like we went through the same exact process because it also seems that your body responds…well, I won’t even say it in that way. I was going to say your body responds well like mine. This has taken you a tremendous effort. There’s been nothing easy about what you’ve achieved and there was no quick wins for me at all. I had zero quick wins. It was slowest as possible wins that you could have and almost losing the whole time and some occasional wins. That’s what it was like for me.
Walter: It’s one step forward, five steps back, one step forward, five steps back. But you just gotta be thankful you got one step forward.
Clint: That’s it.
Walter: Because I also had Baker’s cyst. I forgot to mention, I had the same thing. I had Baker’s cyst in my knees. And then they ruptured, went down into my legs. So yeah, I had the Baker’s cyst in both knees. It was…yeah. So we have…there’s a lot of parallels for sure.
Clint: So many, so many. Well, with regards…
Walter: And it’s slow.
Clint: Yeah. With regards to our time here, is there anything you’d like to run past me before we wind up here?
Walter: I guess so. As far as like juices and stuff, I mean as far as sugar and fruit…I mean, sometimes I guess I struggle with…I mean, is it better to take it…like I like to eat my spinach and eat these things and I know juices are a big…I guess smoothies are a big part of the program. Basically is [inaudible 00:25:53] the vegetables…I mean, the fruit…does that make it easier to digest? I mean, should I be eating it as a salad or should I be eating it as a soup?
Clint: So, yeah. So the answer to that is pretty clear actually. This is pretty, one that we can have a fair degree of certainty about. So you mentioned Danny before, one of our sort of superstars who’s been so helpful to everyone in our community forum as well. I mean the guy’s a legend, right?
Walter: Yeah, for sure.
Clint: So he for a period of time was just living off smoothies and he created his own variety. He would actually put…he would cook his oatmeal and put then put that in with his smoothie and he… Yeah, yeah. So he turned his smoothies into complete meals. So let me just answer with regards to Dr. Greger from nutritionfacts.org, he did a video where he said, “Is it better to eat your greens or put them through a blender?” right, in a smoothie format. And, I think, it’s one of the only…one of the very few cases that I can actually refer to where the processing of the grains in the smoothie machine, like a Vitamix for instance, actually gave more bio-availability to the nutrients and had more uptake of the nutrients than what it just did from eating. And, as a result, people also were able to actually consume more greens, which we know has no benefit and an unlimited benefit. So no downside and an unlimited upside.
Yeah. Okay. And with regards to having, you know, thinking about eating them all the time, for me they’re a big diuretic. I would find if I ate more than too many green smoothies, I was just going to the toilet a lot and it just became ridiculous. You know, this is not really…yeah. And so, I found that if I had a green smoothie as a drink with my main meal then I actually treated that as my salad. And so, what you can do is if you have…sorry. And I’ve got an incoming call on the next…for the next chat here in a moment so I’ll just get to them in a second.
So what you can try is to eat them with food, the green smoothies, because fruit and the greens mixed together can go with a meal when there’s no animal products in the meal. There’s no problem with that. And so, yeah, give that a go. And you’ll get more greens in and you’ll get some great, you know, vital nutrients through the berries. Go for it. So my belief is that the lowest…the starting point, the most lowest irritating green smoothie is baby spinach and blueberries. If you put that combo together, you’ve got one of the most nutrient dense, health promoting things in terms of berries with the most anti-inflammatory food you can eat which is the baby spinach. And you put them together and drink that with your meal as your side instead of a bowl of greens. And not only is it feeling like you’re having a treat but you’re just getting so much benefit from pain relief as well.
Walter: I [inaudible 00:29:27] because I eat blueberries in the morning with my oatmeal and I have spinach later in the day. So I just start combining them.
Clint: If you want to. I mean, this is just in response to your question about smoothies. It sounds to me like… You know, you might not need to tweak too much right now. You might just need to continue to implement things how you are, you know, and continue how you’re going because you’re only four months off the meds and, you know, your body is still adjusting. But yeah, mate. And what I’d like to do is we can chat offline but I’d like you to come and join us for a month in our membership and I’ll give you some coaching and help you out in there as well. You can chat with Danny as well and you guys can hook up. And I think that’ll be nice and you’ll inspire a lot of people because your results are really powerful for other people as well.
Walter: That’s one of the driving things I have is one, to look at my doctor in the face and say, “I told you so”. And B is to help people. I mean, it’s to be able to…if I can help spark someone else, that would be one of the biggest benefits of getting rid of this disease is to be able to help somebody else.
Clint: Well, I can promise you that there are people right now, whether they’d be on their treadmills or in their car, on their way to work who are loving hearing you talk about your progress and everything that you’ve been through because it’s not been all in vain. It hasn’t just been a big painful exercise. There is a future for you to help people and inspire people. And, at some point, I would love to invite you to a live event one day and speak in person because you and I share so much. And it just compounds and accentuates all the messages and experiences that I’ve had and that’s really, really powerful for my message.
Walter: Oh, yeah, I’ll help you any way I can. I would love to talk anybody. I’d love to do it. I mean, that’s one of those things is, all the days when you’re going through this is the eye on the price kind of thing is one day is to help people. I mean, I know the dark hole that I was in one time when I…all [inaudible 00:31:34] never gonna change and I can’t take one more day of this. And if I can help someone, just shine a light into that spot and say, “Look, I’m standing here, my sed rate was this.” and say, “Look, I did it. I came through the wilderness. I’m standing here. And I promise you, you know, it’s not easy. By no means is it easy but it can be done.” And that would be just great,you know, tremendous satisfaction in helping someone.
Clint: Well, as I said, you’re already doing it. So you hold that feeling, hold the feeling that you’ve got right now, in that moment when you picture that, because that is exactly what I pictured. And you are on that path, so.
Walter: That’s awesome. That’s great.
Clint: Thank you, man. So I would love to talk to you longer but I have got to get to our next talk. So we will stay in touch online. Email me and I’ll hook you up.
Walter: Okay. That sounds awesome, Clint.
Clint: Thanks so much again.
Walter: Thanks [inaudible 00:32:33]
Walter: See you.